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Correspondence:
DAVE HUNT’S VISIT
I must write and thank you for arranging and advertising Dave Hunt’s visit to NZ. What a time of BLESSING. The whole Church (Gospel Hall) from Kaikoura was there, as well as friends from Christchurch, Ashburton, Nelson … and especially Ruth and Darrell and other familiar faces from Blenheim. At the third meeting Calvary Chapel was packed — standing room only for latecomers. I wish we could just go on and on like that … And now another CETF has just arrived — more good reading.
Thanks a lot, Philip, and may the Lord richly bless you both, and continue to use you for His glory.
Christian love,
BE, South Island, NZ (donation sent)
SICK OF CHURCH
I have watched your CWM program on Bris31 for some time. I am a Christian for many years and have grown very disillusioned with churches that seem to model themselves on the notion of Greek Oratory rather than the biblical pattern.
We have the “Praise and Worship” team up the front, acting more like a worldly pop concert than worshippers, a “pastor” who perpetuates the division between “clergy” and “laity” — deeds of the Nicolaitans (“Nico” = to conquer; “Laos” = the people) and whose parallel, is nowhere to be found in the Bible, and we have the sermon (contrary to what Corinthians teaches) where I situp, shutup, payup, look at the back of someone’s head, then get-out.
What have we made the assembly of the Saints?
How do your churches operate?
Do you believe in the fundamentals of Pentecost, which are fruit, gifts and (whole body) ministry?
Do you believe in the baptism in the Holy Spirit (as opposed to what Pentecostal churches today say about it), the priesthood of all believers, etc?
I have become so sick of the modern “church” and socalled pastors controlling God’s people that I no longer attend — rather I want to almost vomit at the thought — yet at the same time, my heart is for the assembly and the knowledge of the Holy — here is the dilemma.
Could you please answer my questions coming from one seeking a good biblical church environment and the fellowship of those of like mind. Many thanks. Regards,
JF, North Brisbane
JF, CWM doesn’t profess to have achieved the perfect “church” model, but we do try to be biblical.
We share AW Tozer’s desire to keep “performers out of the pulpit” whether they are musicians or preachers. We believe that worship should include sound exposition of scripture by someone who is called of God to preach and teach and is not a novice.
If you do a
search on our web site under BIBLICISM VERSUS CESSATIONISM you will get some of the answers to your questions from our perspective.
Here is part of a slightly modified statement, which addresses the Pentecostal issue that you will find there (from an earlier letter):
Sadly some are jettisoning the genuine by overreacting to the false. CWM is trying to redress this situation. We are by and large “traditional’ or “classical” Pentecostals, which means that we believe in the present day reality of the ministry of the Holy Spirit in fruit and gift including the supernatural “manifestations” listed in 1 Corinthians 12:7-11. The positive to all this is that hard line evangelical churches are increasingly interested in a sane presentation of the classical Pentecostal view. For example, I personally have found a warm welcome among Presbyterian churches, one going so far as to invite me to preach on the Ministry and Work of the Holy Spirit.
For those who are interested, however, I have done a miniseries of 3 Bible talks on the topic as follows:
1) Are the Gifts of the Spirit Valid Today?
2) When May We Speak in Tongues—If Ever?
3) Not By Might … But By My Spirit.
These talks are
available on audiotape, as listed in our CWM Resource Catalogue. One pastor after listening to two of the messages told me he would order 10 or 15 sets so that his home groups could study the material.
The last chapter of the book
Gathering the Faithful Remnant that I co-authored with Aeron Morgan puts forward my view on Baptism in the Holy Spirit.
The book is available
HERE...
Order Form
HERE...or
HERE...
PLP
BIBLE VERSIONS
Hello, I watch your programme on Bris31 and I get your magazine too.
I am wondering what do you think of modern translations?
I am a King James user and I don’t like how modern translations take out doctrines like 1 John 4:3 that Christ came in the fiesh and 1 John 5:6-8 where they take out from “in heaven” to “in earth”. 2 Samuel 5:21 talks about David and the Philistine idols (KJV) says that David burned the idols. The modern versions say that David took them away. O, yes I think it is a serious issue. There is also a false King James Version too (KJV-2000) put out by the Bible League. I support the traditional KJV Bible.
SB, QLD, Australia
SB, CWM shares your concern about the many modern so-called translations of Scripture, some of which refiect personal ideas and are not God’s Word. The problem is that people who read them think they are reading the Word of God when they are not.
The result is great confusion and wrong teaching.
CWM is NOT King James Only, but we do respect the King James version as possibly being the best English translation available and a very good Bible from which to establish your doctrine and from which to study.
YES — I too am a King James user, like yourself and most of our people probably follow this example, though we do compare versions and try to understand the message of the Bible based on the original languages as much as we can. As you say there are different KJV around. The original was 1611, but these are very rare. I note that one of the Bible programmes that I have on my computer says: This is the 1769 King James Version of the Holy Bible (also known as the Authorized Version). Please do stay in touch.
Hope to see you some time at our CWM- Fellowship in Brisbane.
Every blessing —PLP
CWM — LINKS
I have just begun researching CWM on the net and am very concerned and at the same time, excited about this important ministry. My main concern is the obvious misconduct throughout the AOG movement, while at the same time CWM appears to be affiliated with AOG to a degree.
How can CWM still be a part of its churches!
Looking through the CWM site I came across the name of Gordon Moyes of the Wesley Centre there. Isn’t the Uniting Church ordaining gay and lesbian pastors?
How can Gordon Moyes, who I believe is doing a wonderful job for GOD in Australia, continue to support a church that so blatantly disobeys the scriptures, by approving gay & lesbian ministers? Bless you all,
EH, NSW North Coast, Australia
EH, you have settled on one of the big problems of our time. In practically everything there is the “mixture” — good and bad.
We try to identify and sometimes associate with the good and genuine in many mixed up movements e.g. AoG from which I resigned as National General Secretary years ago.
I recognise that there are still good pastors and people within the denomination. Incidentally CWM has no formal links with the official AoG movement though I do preach in some of their churches overseas and I keep knocking on their door as I sense that is required of me by scripture.
The hierarchy refuses to meet with me, but as you point out we do associate with some good men among them who, as far as we know, lead good churches e.g. Patrick Russell of Bowen, AoG. CWM has no formal association with Gordon Moyes, but we do respect the stand he takes in his denomination and we try to give him support.
From time to time we do publish his material. I trust this explains our position.
—PLP
SONG OF SONGS — UK
We talked for a couple of minutes after your meeting in England when you spoke on the Song of Songs.
Thank you again for what you said. The Lord confirmed a number of things to me. I am a university student training to teach primary school aged children. I was deeply involved with the large Christian Union (CU) until a year ago when they organised their first mission. In the lead up the vice president recounted how God told her to be specific in our evangelistic desires and how she replied, “Okay we want to see 50 people saved”.
This was taken as a prophecy. Mission week came and passed and 50 people were not saved!
The reaction of the vice-president shocked me. She announced at the next meeting (after the mission) that God didn’t necessarily mean 50 people in this one week, but that it could occur over our time at the college.
I began to question what was happening. To me this was clearly a false prophecy that was being covered over instead of repented of! You mentioned in your talk on the Saturday about naming false prophets. This confirmed to me that I am not being unloving, but doing what God’s Word requires. I will ensure that I encourage people to test things they hear against the Bible as our divine guide.
A second mission occurred in May (2004) and a third in October. I felt not to be a part, which caused problems and friction. I had two choices, pleasing people or pleasing God and I made my decision to please God.
At your meeting you also referred to a pastor’s wife doing a series of talks entitled ‘Kingdom Women Love Sex’. I had previously been concerned over the title of a Tuesday lunch-time talk on the weekly CU schedule, “Do Christians have the best sex?” I think this is an inappropriate topic to be used in ‘evangelism’. Your reference to the pastor’s wife was an encouragement that my parents and I are not alone in considering this type of thing to be inappropriate.
Another point you made was about not speaking as the world. Others had pointed out the worldly language used by modern writers in reference to the things of the Lord. I didn’t see it at first but when you and my parents discussed how our language needs to be heavenly not worldly I really felt a conviction that despite how my generation talks I need to be making myself more like Christ who I doubt would use words like ‘cool’ and ‘groovy’ etc.
You referred to the pope, Nicky Gumbel and the alpha course and how they have removed from Alpha the parts about homosexuality being “an abomination” in the eyes of the Lord. (I did not know about this recent development). The CU runs student alpha courses and were planning one to follow up their most recent mission week. After reading Elizabeth McDonald’s Alpha Course, the unofficial guide I realised the deep heresies surrounding it.
Your reference confirmed how far these people (and the devil) will go to get others into the false church. I am asking for the Lord’s strength to be able to mention some of these facts to my Christian friends who are Alpha fans. Please pray for me and my CU friends. So much of what you said Saturday night spoke directly to me. I can see the Lord’s working in bringing me home for that weekend. It was the only weekend of the entire term that I was able to get home before Christmas. I wanted to encourage you to keep preaching the truth no matter what we come up against. “It is better to hear the rebuke of the wise, than for a man (or woman in my case) to hear the song of fools” (Ecclesiastes 7:5). Thank you once again,
CB, West Country, UK
BENNY HINN AT IT AGAIN
It was well said that truth is the first casualty in any war. In the battle for the souls of men TRUTH is the defining difference. Sadly many of the televangelists including the biggest of them all, Mr Benny Hinn, are proven liars of the first magnitude. Benny Hinn’s lies have been documented back to his claims of being healed from stuttering, and his Israeli connections and being the son of the mayor of Jaffa etc. (He also claims that the Lord Jesus appeared to him when he was a child.) How Christians can follow such a falsifier of veracity is incredible. And now he’s at it again.
In his recent Indian Festival of Blessings in Bangalore conducted at Jakkur airfield on January 21, 22 and 23, 2005 Hinn’s website claims 1.5 million at the first meeting and 7 million over all. Local secular newspapers put attendance at the first meeting as low as 300,000 and as high as 600,000 and claim that overall there were between 1 million and 1.5 million attendees. That’s a very big difference, but then even 1 million aggregate is a lot of people, if numbers count for anything and really in India they don’t.
I visited India in the 1980s on five or six occasions. An honest Assemblies of God pastor, now General Superintendent of South India A/G, told me that he did not know of one long lasting result from mass evangelistic crusades and he had acted as interpreter at several with crowds up to 300,000. It’s not difficult to get large crowds in India especially if you have lots of money. With Benny Hinn there’s no shortage of money nor of lies.
Hinn and his entourage, which local newspapers claimed included several body-guards and 20 guard dogs were housed in the Leela Palace Hotel, Bangalore, where Hotel discount rates range from $350 to $528 (US) per room per night. Hinn’s organisation secured an entire fioor.
http://www.hoteltravel.com/india/ bangalore/leela.htm
Here’s a description of the living conditions of most of those who would have attended Hinn’s meetings, taken from the FACTS ABOUT INDIA website — http://www.lhmint.org/facts/india/
“India remains a very poor nation, with an average yearly income of $350. It faces health challenges stemming from poverty, malnutrition, poor sanitation, over population, and a literacy rate of only 53 percent.”
If Mr Hinn were the servant of the Lord with the anointing that he claims why would he need bodyguards let alone guard dogs?
My Indian pastor friend told me that Hinn arrived at each meeting and departed by helicopter. He also told me that he had not heard of any outstanding miracle.
Of course Hinn tells the usual lies about healings and miracles but the secular newspapers claimed that the only platform testimonies were from Hinn’s associates. The ordinary people were not allowed onto the platform to speak or to be seen.
DOCTORS RUBBISH HINN’S CLAIMS
BANGALORE, DHNS of 23/01/05 under the above heading “Report” —
Dr Srinivasa Gowda, Registrar of Rajiv Gandhi University of Health Sciences, termed Hinn’s claims of restoring sight to a visually impaired person as “fraudulent activity”, which should not be encouraged. “The show should not have happened with so much of pomp and gaiety. It is a bad trend,” he added.
The Deccan Herald of the same date under the heading HEALER HELPLESS When the “miracle” failed to save a life reported:
For a 52-year-old man, the Benny Hinn event was not a fortunate one. He reportedly died of cardiac arrest at the venue on Saturday evening, reports DHNS, Bangalore.
According to police, the wheelchairbound man, a heart patient, had come to get healed along with scores of people. The victim suffered an attack and died even as the evangelist commenced the healing service, a police officer said. However, the organisers were evasive about the incident.
They said, “He was administered first aid and then taken in an ambulance to a nearby hospital for treatment. We know nothing more”. But the police confirmed seeing the man die of cardiac arrest.
A later newspaper reported that the deceased person’s doctor was trying to sue Benny Hinn. Here’s an eyewitness report from a resident of Bangalore:
My unanswered questions and the Festival of Blessings:
I had the privilege to attend the Festival of Blessing on the First day and the last day from the beginning to the end. … …. right from the day one, I have some unanswered questions and the questions are:
- 1. Why Jesus Christ was presented only as the healer not as the saviour of the world or the Lord (one who rules and directs) of Christians?
- 2. Why there was no preaching concerning sin, its condemnation, reality of heaven and hell, the forgiveness one can have freely by the grace of God?
- 3. Why the numbers concerning the strength of the crowd are exaggerated 4-5 times? (On the First day, the actual crowd could be less than 4 lakhs1 but announced repeatedly as 20 lakhs (2 million). On the last day, the actual crowd could be less than 7 lakhs but announced as 30 lakhs (3 million).
- 4. Why the preacher went on rebuking the diseases? (Bible does not talk about rebuking diseases. Jesus and His disciples did not rebuke the diseases but healed by praying /touching /laying hands.)
- 5. The preacher mentioned on first day that the Holy Spirit told him not to collect offering and his ministry would bear all the expenses for the crusade but went on collecting the offerings on the second and third days. Why did he use the name of the Holy Spirit in vain?
- 6. Why did the preacher preach the false hope? (He stated that ALL who come to the healing meeting will be healed but the reality is not that).
Note: As some of you fear, this message is not aimed at spoiling someone’s reputation.
We need to understand that the WORD OF GOD SHOULD NOT BE ALLOWED TO SUFFER AT THE COST OF SAVING SOMEBODY’S REPUTATION.
You may question the use/necessity of these messages.
[ But if false works or words are being spread around, in the name of Our Lord, we must warn others to BEaware
-Ed ]
It is not to offend or defend anyone but to alert and avert.
Thanks! Grace and guidance of Our Lord Jesus Christ be with you,
(——), Bangalore.
Hinn openly condemned those Indian Christians who said that idolatry is wrong. He thus ended up doing in India precisely what he did in Italy viz he supported idolatry. In the case of Italy it was the idolatry of the Roman Catholic Church with her veneration of Mary and of statues. In India it has sunken to a new low level. Now Hinn tacitly supports Hinduism. Where will all this end? The answer is obvious. There are ominous signs that things will grow worse before they get better.
IS BENNY HINN ANTI-CHRIST?
When Canon Andrew White, Special Envoy of the Archbishop of Canterbury to Iraq, appeared twice on Benny Hinn’s telecast last year (2004), he said that the church “needs to repent about how it has perceived the Palestinian people” (This is Your Day, April 26, 27 2004,) and that when he, White, was entering Saddam’s palace he clearly heard God speak “Babylon has fallen Babylon has fallen” (This is Your Day, Aug. 16, 2004). White implied that Revelation chapter 14 has been fulfilled, which is clearly false, and Hinn did NOT correct him, nor did he correct him about the Palestinians who are the ones who need to repent of their constant terrorism. His silence when White said that the church should repent put Hinn and White on the side of the Palestinians against the church and against the Israelis. Benny Hinn called Canon Andrew White a “wonderful person ... who’s serving Jesus and loves the Lord with all his heart ... (a) charismatic (who is) full of the Holy Spirit”. REALLY? How’s this for the credentials of a “wonderful person” who is “full of the Holy Spirit”?
- 1) White represents the Archbishop of Canterbury who is a druid and who has twice agreed to appoint a gay bishop, and has endorsed the new Bible translation Good as New that promotes fornication.
- 2) White is key person at the International Centre of Reconciliation through The Community of the Cross of Nails an extension of Coventry Cathedral’s international ministry for reconciliation and part of the Anglican Diocese of Canterbury, which White represents. Coventry Cathedral has a prohomosexual stance and is working toward ecumenical unity.
- 3) White is also participating in the Alexandria Process which states “The Holy Land is holy to all three of our faiths. Therefore, followers of the divine religions must respect its sanctity”… Islam is included as a divine religion.
- 4) White has stated, “I’m working intimately with all of the religious Islamic, Jewish, Christian leaders.” (He received two major awards for his interfaith work. One is an Interfaith Award by British Foreign Office Minister, Baroness Symons).
White claims, “One of the reasons why the Middle-East peace process has failed is it’s too secular.” So he wants to see religion play a bigger part in the peace process.
During the interview White related to Hinn how Tamimi (who is no angel) said, “We need Pastor Benny Hinn.” White commented, “I was sitting down with him one day around Yasser Arafat’s table, and he said to President Arafat, ‘Raed, we need Benny Hinn.’ He [Tamimi] said to me, “Arafat raised his eyebrows and said, ‘He’s one of our boys.” Considering Hinn is an Arab who was raised in Palestine this has ominous significance.
White said to Hinn, “They realize that you probably infiuence more Christians across the globe than anybody else. And, uh, they know that in order to bring about change, we’ve got to have the representatives of the biggest churches. We need people like you (Benny Hinn) to be able to be a liaison between the people there and the people here.”
Hinn’s celebrity status in the “church” seems to be the answer for White wanting to get him involved in the peace process, despite his lack of biblical knowledge and integrity. It is beyond any understanding that White would want Hinn to be involved with the peace process. He may be unaware or ignoring purposely his past faux pas, exaggerations, embellishments, fantasy stories and false prophecies.
Nonetheless, this puts Hinn in a position of infiuence unlike any other Christian leader.
Hinn asked Andrew White, “What will I do if I join, when . I met him of course, and what did you say to me?”
White: “I said … [that] really as the one of the foremost Christian leaders of the world today you could play a very strategic role in not only healing some of the wrongs that the church has done to Israelis and Palestinians but also being a link between what goes on [in] Israel and Palestine what goes on in the US.” (The above information was provided by Mike Oppenheimer who recorded the interviews. Source: www.letusreason.org)
I doubt that Mr Hinn is the anti-Christ, but certainly he is doing the work of the anti-Christ and of his master, the devil.
It’s high time all Christians in the west did what the Pentecostals did in Italy viz disassociate totally from Benny Hinn and expose him for what he is a charlatan and a fraud. Those who promote him should repent publicly.
—PLP
1 A lakh is an Indian term for 100,000 so 10 lakhs = 1 million
POLICY: We value and encourage your communications on any matter and especially on subjects raised in our publications. However due to the large amount of correspondence that we receive Philip Powell can not undertake to answer personal correspondence.
WE are receiving so many letters and emails that it is impractical to publish them all.
CWM issues a regular electronic Mailer, which among other things seeks to warn Christians about false doctrine and abusive practices within the Christian community.
Good advice resulted from our publishing the story.
You can join the CWM Mailer at http://www. christian-witness.org/join.html for future despatches.
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-Last revised-
Monday, October 09, 2006
